Talk:Diablo Extras repository proposal - Revision history

imported_>generalantilles: Talk:Diablo extras repository proposal moved to Talk:Diablo Extras repository proposal: Capitalizing Extras

2008-06-30T12:16:57Z

Talk:Diablo extras repository proposal moved to Talk:Diablo Extras repository proposal: Capitalizing Extras

← Older revision	Revision as of 12:16, 30 June 2008
(No difference)

127.0.0.1: /* Please, Keep Original Submission Procedure for Binary Packages */

2008-06-27T08:07:43Z

Please, Keep Original Submission Procedure for Binary Packages

← Older revision		Revision as of 08:07, 27 June 2008
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	== Please, Keep Original Submission Procedure for Binary Packages ==		== Please, Keep Original Submission Procedure for Binary Packages ==
	I strongly suggest that you keep the original dput-based submission procedure for binary packages, possibly marking them as non-free. The suggested submission procedure with autobuilder + promotion (1) requires the source code (not available for closed source packages) and (2) takes much more time than just doing a "dput", complicating frequent package updates. This ~~force~~ developers to ignore Extras repository and either create their own repositories or not use repository model at all. While centering submission process around the source code has valiant open-source intentions, it basically limits developers' freedom to distribute their software ~~however they want~~. Any barriers to package submission (however idealistic their reasons are) will harm end users who expect most NIT software to be available from a single repository. [[User:fms\|fms]]		I strongly suggest that you keep the original dput-based submission procedure for binary packages, possibly marking them as non-free. The suggested submission procedure with autobuilder + promotion (1) requires the source code (not available for closed source packages) and (2) takes much more time than just doing a "dput", complicating frequent package updates. This forces developers to ignore Extras repository and either create their own repositories or not use repository model at all. While centering submission process around the source code has valiant open-source intentions, it basically limits developers' freedom to distribute their software via centralized Extras repository. Any barriers to package submission (however idealistic their reasons are) will harm end users who expect most NIT software to be available from a single repository. [[User:fms\|fms]]

127.0.0.1 at 08:06, 27 June 2008

2008-06-27T08:06:24Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 08:06, 27 June 2008
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	::::::Alright, let me rephrase my own question above: would it make sense to differentiate free and non-free extras packages in different sections? (the discussion about Nokia packages is not urgent and belongs to somewhere else)--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:56, 22 June 2008 (UTC)		::::::Alright, let me rephrase my own question above: would it make sense to differentiate free and non-free extras packages in different sections? (the discussion about Nokia packages is not urgent and belongs to somewhere else)--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:56, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
	:::::::From the user's point of view? Probably not. From a community point of view? Not sure. From Nokia's point-of-view? I'm not in a position to answer, but is it likely/possible that at some point extras (in some form) will be enabled by default? If so, does a free/non-free separation have any bearing on it? --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 20:05, 22 June 2008 (UTC)		:::::::From the user's point of view? Probably not. From a community point of view? Not sure. From Nokia's point-of-view? I'm not in a position to answer, but is it likely/possible that at some point extras (in some form) will be enabled by default? If so, does a free/non-free separation have any bearing on it? --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 20:05, 22 June 2008 (UTC)

			== Please, Keep Original Submission Procedure for Binary Packages ==
			I strongly suggest that you keep the original dput-based submission procedure for binary packages, possibly marking them as non-free. The suggested submission procedure with autobuilder + promotion (1) requires the source code (not available for closed source packages) and (2) takes much more time than just doing a "dput", complicating frequent package updates. This force developers to ignore Extras repository and either create their own repositories or not use repository model at all. While centering submission process around the source code has valiant open-source intentions, it basically limits developers' freedom to distribute their software however they want. Any barriers to package submission (however idealistic their reasons are) will harm end users who expect most NIT software to be available from a single repository. [[User:fms\|fms]]

imported_>qgil: /* Binary-only packages? */

2008-06-23T11:00:32Z

Binary-only packages?

← Older revision		Revision as of 11:00, 23 June 2008
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	::::What is the relation between having separate sections for free/non-free and frequency of updates? In any case I'm thinking more about the Fremantle timeline since Diablo is too soon to implement radical changes.--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:38, 22 June 2008 (UTC)		::::What is the relation between having separate sections for free/non-free and frequency of updates? In any case I'm thinking more about the Fremantle timeline since Diablo is too soon to implement radical changes.--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:38, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
	::::This SSU thing is an entirely different thing and is not being served from the extras repository. As I understand it is for ''system'' updates (applications part of the base system, not for ''application'' updates (community provided applications). --[[User:xfade\|xfade]] 10:10, 23 June 2008 (UTC)		::::This SSU thing is an entirely different thing and is not being served from the extras repository. As I understand it is for ''system'' updates (applications part of the base system, not for ''application'' updates (community provided applications). --[[User:xfade\|xfade]] 10:10, 23 June 2008 (UTC)
			:::::I still fail to see what is the relation between SSU and free/non-free, but I just thorught youd like to know that yes, users get SSU updates when new versions of their installed extras software are available.--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 11:00, 23 June 2008 (UTC)
	:::::If the frequency of updates is on the same order of magnitude of current "maemo Linux based OS" releases (i.e. a couple a year), carefully crafting the naming seems to me to be a monumental waste of effort. However, if a) there's going to be lots and lots and some careful differentiation is required; or there'll be many more Nokia self-installable apps released (or other, non-free apps in addition to the couple we've got already); the distinction may be worth investing in. Alternatively, I've got the wrong end of the stick. --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 19:43, 22 June 2008 (UTC)		:::::If the frequency of updates is on the same order of magnitude of current "maemo Linux based OS" releases (i.e. a couple a year), carefully crafting the naming seems to me to be a monumental waste of effort. However, if a) there's going to be lots and lots and some careful differentiation is required; or there'll be many more Nokia self-installable apps released (or other, non-free apps in addition to the couple we've got already); the distinction may be worth investing in. Alternatively, I've got the wrong end of the stick. --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 19:43, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
	::::::Alright, let me rephrase my own question above: would it make sense to differentiate free and non-free extras packages in different sections? (the discussion about Nokia packages is not urgent and belongs to somewhere else)--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:56, 22 June 2008 (UTC)		::::::Alright, let me rephrase my own question above: would it make sense to differentiate free and non-free extras packages in different sections? (the discussion about Nokia packages is not urgent and belongs to somewhere else)--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:56, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
	:::::::From the user's point of view? Probably not. From a community point of view? Not sure. From Nokia's point-of-view? I'm not in a position to answer, but is it likely/possible that at some point extras (in some form) will be enabled by default? If so, does a free/non-free separation have any bearing on it? --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 20:05, 22 June 2008 (UTC)		:::::::From the user's point of view? Probably not. From a community point of view? Not sure. From Nokia's point-of-view? I'm not in a position to answer, but is it likely/possible that at some point extras (in some form) will be enabled by default? If so, does a free/non-free separation have any bearing on it? --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 20:05, 22 June 2008 (UTC)

imported_>xfade: add comments

2008-06-23T10:10:42Z

add comments

← Older revision		Revision as of 10:10, 23 June 2008
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	:Of course, a "source" package is just a package which can be extracted, a particular command run and a binary deb produced. There's nothing stopping closed source authors such as INDT producing a "source" package containing the binary files and a script to produce the binary deb. This'd satisfy the "only packages which can be built using the autobuilder" requirement ''and'' add an extra level of complexity to people wanting to use the maemo.org '''community''' repository for their closed source applications. --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 18:59, 21 June 2008 (UTC)		:Of course, a "source" package is just a package which can be extracted, a particular command run and a binary deb produced. There's nothing stopping closed source authors such as INDT producing a "source" package containing the binary files and a script to produce the binary deb. This'd satisfy the "only packages which can be built using the autobuilder" requirement ''and'' add an extra level of complexity to people wanting to use the maemo.org '''community''' repository for their closed source applications. --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 18:59, 21 June 2008 (UTC)
	::As a note aside, should we discusse now the possibility of having free & non-free sections (or universe / multiverse) for these 3rd party repository that today we call extras? I mean, imagine that one day Nokia packages are published as i.e. Main / Restricted. Is this on topic here?--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:11, 22 June 2008 (UTC)		::As a note aside, should we discusse now the possibility of having free & non-free sections (or universe / multiverse) for these 3rd party repository that today we call extras? I mean, imagine that one day Nokia packages are published as i.e. Main / Restricted. Is this on topic here?--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:11, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
			::I think the free/non-free thing would be a good solution. But for the community repository, surely we should aim to have as much source available as possible. --[[User:xfade\|xfade]] 10:10, 23 June 2008 (UTC)
	:::Wherever possible, I'm in favour of copying best practice. If it's good enough for Ubuntu to copy (and tweak) from Debian, it should be possible for us to copy from Ubuntu (and tweak). Having said that, until diablo's released (I put off installing the unreleased version), I think SSU is too much of a wildcard to make ''many'' decisions now. Are there any plans on Nokia's side as to the frequency of a release's in-life updates? Feature enhancements? Bug fixes? Security fixes? Or will SSU solely be used for big bang releases without having to reflash? --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 19:21, 22 June 2008 (UTC)		:::Wherever possible, I'm in favour of copying best practice. If it's good enough for Ubuntu to copy (and tweak) from Debian, it should be possible for us to copy from Ubuntu (and tweak). Having said that, until diablo's released (I put off installing the unreleased version), I think SSU is too much of a wildcard to make ''many'' decisions now. Are there any plans on Nokia's side as to the frequency of a release's in-life updates? Feature enhancements? Bug fixes? Security fixes? Or will SSU solely be used for big bang releases without having to reflash? --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 19:21, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
	::::What is the relation between having separate sections for free/non-free and frequency of updates? In any case I'm thinking more about the Fremantle timeline since Diablo is too soon to implement radical changes.--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:38, 22 June 2008 (UTC)		::::What is the relation between having separate sections for free/non-free and frequency of updates? In any case I'm thinking more about the Fremantle timeline since Diablo is too soon to implement radical changes.--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:38, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
			::::This SSU thing is an entirely different thing and is not being served from the extras repository. As I understand it is for ''system'' updates (applications part of the base system, not for ''application'' updates (community provided applications). --[[User:xfade\|xfade]] 10:10, 23 June 2008 (UTC)
	:::::If the frequency of updates is on the same order of magnitude of current "maemo Linux based OS" releases (i.e. a couple a year), carefully crafting the naming seems to me to be a monumental waste of effort. However, if a) there's going to be lots and lots and some careful differentiation is required; or there'll be many more Nokia self-installable apps released (or other, non-free apps in addition to the couple we've got already); the distinction may be worth investing in. Alternatively, I've got the wrong end of the stick. --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 19:43, 22 June 2008 (UTC)		:::::If the frequency of updates is on the same order of magnitude of current "maemo Linux based OS" releases (i.e. a couple a year), carefully crafting the naming seems to me to be a monumental waste of effort. However, if a) there's going to be lots and lots and some careful differentiation is required; or there'll be many more Nokia self-installable apps released (or other, non-free apps in addition to the couple we've got already); the distinction may be worth investing in. Alternatively, I've got the wrong end of the stick. --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 19:43, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
	::::::Alright, let me rephrase my own question above: would it make sense to differentiate free and non-free extras packages in different sections? (the discussion about Nokia packages is not urgent and belongs to somewhere else)--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:56, 22 June 2008 (UTC)		::::::Alright, let me rephrase my own question above: would it make sense to differentiate free and non-free extras packages in different sections? (the discussion about Nokia packages is not urgent and belongs to somewhere else)--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:56, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
	:::::::From the user's point of view? Probably not. From a community point of view? Not sure. From Nokia's point-of-view? I'm not in a position to answer, but is it likely/possible that at some point extras (in some form) will be enabled by default? If so, does a free/non-free separation have any bearing on it? --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 20:05, 22 June 2008 (UTC)		:::::::From the user's point of view? Probably not. From a community point of view? Not sure. From Nokia's point-of-view? I'm not in a position to answer, but is it likely/possible that at some point extras (in some form) will be enabled by default? If so, does a free/non-free separation have any bearing on it? --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 20:05, 22 June 2008 (UTC)

imported_>jaffa: /* Binary-only packages? */ Random thoughts

2008-06-22T20:05:07Z

Binary-only packages?: Random thoughts

← Older revision		Revision as of 20:05, 22 June 2008
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	:::::If the frequency of updates is on the same order of magnitude of current "maemo Linux based OS" releases (i.e. a couple a year), carefully crafting the naming seems to me to be a monumental waste of effort. However, if a) there's going to be lots and lots and some careful differentiation is required; or there'll be many more Nokia self-installable apps released (or other, non-free apps in addition to the couple we've got already); the distinction may be worth investing in. Alternatively, I've got the wrong end of the stick. --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 19:43, 22 June 2008 (UTC)		:::::If the frequency of updates is on the same order of magnitude of current "maemo Linux based OS" releases (i.e. a couple a year), carefully crafting the naming seems to me to be a monumental waste of effort. However, if a) there's going to be lots and lots and some careful differentiation is required; or there'll be many more Nokia self-installable apps released (or other, non-free apps in addition to the couple we've got already); the distinction may be worth investing in. Alternatively, I've got the wrong end of the stick. --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 19:43, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
	::::::Alright, let me rephrase my own question above: would it make sense to differentiate free and non-free extras packages in different sections? (the discussion about Nokia packages is not urgent and belongs to somewhere else)--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:56, 22 June 2008 (UTC)		::::::Alright, let me rephrase my own question above: would it make sense to differentiate free and non-free extras packages in different sections? (the discussion about Nokia packages is not urgent and belongs to somewhere else)--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:56, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
			:::::::From the user's point of view? Probably not. From a community point of view? Not sure. From Nokia's point-of-view? I'm not in a position to answer, but is it likely/possible that at some point extras (in some form) will be enabled by default? If so, does a free/non-free separation have any bearing on it? --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 20:05, 22 June 2008 (UTC)

imported_>qgil: /* Binary-only packages? */

2008-06-22T19:56:23Z

Binary-only packages?

← Older revision		Revision as of 19:56, 22 June 2008
Line 22:		Line 22:
	::::What is the relation between having separate sections for free/non-free and frequency of updates? In any case I'm thinking more about the Fremantle timeline since Diablo is too soon to implement radical changes.--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:38, 22 June 2008 (UTC)		::::What is the relation between having separate sections for free/non-free and frequency of updates? In any case I'm thinking more about the Fremantle timeline since Diablo is too soon to implement radical changes.--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:38, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
	:::::If the frequency of updates is on the same order of magnitude of current "maemo Linux based OS" releases (i.e. a couple a year), carefully crafting the naming seems to me to be a monumental waste of effort. However, if a) there's going to be lots and lots and some careful differentiation is required; or there'll be many more Nokia self-installable apps released (or other, non-free apps in addition to the couple we've got already); the distinction may be worth investing in. Alternatively, I've got the wrong end of the stick. --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 19:43, 22 June 2008 (UTC)		:::::If the frequency of updates is on the same order of magnitude of current "maemo Linux based OS" releases (i.e. a couple a year), carefully crafting the naming seems to me to be a monumental waste of effort. However, if a) there's going to be lots and lots and some careful differentiation is required; or there'll be many more Nokia self-installable apps released (or other, non-free apps in addition to the couple we've got already); the distinction may be worth investing in. Alternatively, I've got the wrong end of the stick. --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 19:43, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
			::::::Alright, let me rephrase my own question above: would it make sense to differentiate free and non-free extras packages in different sections? (the discussion about Nokia packages is not urgent and belongs to somewhere else)--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:56, 22 June 2008 (UTC)

imported_>jaffa: /* Binary-only packages? */ Forgot signature

2008-06-22T19:43:19Z

Binary-only packages?: Forgot signature

← Older revision		Revision as of 19:43, 22 June 2008
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	:::Wherever possible, I'm in favour of copying best practice. If it's good enough for Ubuntu to copy (and tweak) from Debian, it should be possible for us to copy from Ubuntu (and tweak). Having said that, until diablo's released (I put off installing the unreleased version), I think SSU is too much of a wildcard to make ''many'' decisions now. Are there any plans on Nokia's side as to the frequency of a release's in-life updates? Feature enhancements? Bug fixes? Security fixes? Or will SSU solely be used for big bang releases without having to reflash? --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 19:21, 22 June 2008 (UTC)		:::Wherever possible, I'm in favour of copying best practice. If it's good enough for Ubuntu to copy (and tweak) from Debian, it should be possible for us to copy from Ubuntu (and tweak). Having said that, until diablo's released (I put off installing the unreleased version), I think SSU is too much of a wildcard to make ''many'' decisions now. Are there any plans on Nokia's side as to the frequency of a release's in-life updates? Feature enhancements? Bug fixes? Security fixes? Or will SSU solely be used for big bang releases without having to reflash? --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 19:21, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
	::::What is the relation between having separate sections for free/non-free and frequency of updates? In any case I'm thinking more about the Fremantle timeline since Diablo is too soon to implement radical changes.--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:38, 22 June 2008 (UTC)		::::What is the relation between having separate sections for free/non-free and frequency of updates? In any case I'm thinking more about the Fremantle timeline since Diablo is too soon to implement radical changes.--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:38, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
	:::::If the frequency of updates is on the same order of magnitude of current "maemo Linux based OS" releases (i.e. a couple a year), carefully crafting the naming seems to me to be a monumental waste of effort. However, if a) there's going to be lots and lots and some careful differentiation is required; or there'll be many more Nokia self-installable apps released (or other, non-free apps in addition to the couple we've got already); the distinction may be worth investing in. Alternatively, I've got the wrong end of the stick.		:::::If the frequency of updates is on the same order of magnitude of current "maemo Linux based OS" releases (i.e. a couple a year), carefully crafting the naming seems to me to be a monumental waste of effort. However, if a) there's going to be lots and lots and some careful differentiation is required; or there'll be many more Nokia self-installable apps released (or other, non-free apps in addition to the couple we've got already); the distinction may be worth investing in. Alternatively, I've got the wrong end of the stick. --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 19:43, 22 June 2008 (UTC)

imported_>jaffa: /* Binary-only packages? */

2008-06-22T19:43:00Z

Binary-only packages?

← Older revision		Revision as of 19:43, 22 June 2008
Line 21:		Line 21:
	:::Wherever possible, I'm in favour of copying best practice. If it's good enough for Ubuntu to copy (and tweak) from Debian, it should be possible for us to copy from Ubuntu (and tweak). Having said that, until diablo's released (I put off installing the unreleased version), I think SSU is too much of a wildcard to make ''many'' decisions now. Are there any plans on Nokia's side as to the frequency of a release's in-life updates? Feature enhancements? Bug fixes? Security fixes? Or will SSU solely be used for big bang releases without having to reflash? --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 19:21, 22 June 2008 (UTC)		:::Wherever possible, I'm in favour of copying best practice. If it's good enough for Ubuntu to copy (and tweak) from Debian, it should be possible for us to copy from Ubuntu (and tweak). Having said that, until diablo's released (I put off installing the unreleased version), I think SSU is too much of a wildcard to make ''many'' decisions now. Are there any plans on Nokia's side as to the frequency of a release's in-life updates? Feature enhancements? Bug fixes? Security fixes? Or will SSU solely be used for big bang releases without having to reflash? --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 19:21, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
	::::What is the relation between having separate sections for free/non-free and frequency of updates? In any case I'm thinking more about the Fremantle timeline since Diablo is too soon to implement radical changes.--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:38, 22 June 2008 (UTC)		::::What is the relation between having separate sections for free/non-free and frequency of updates? In any case I'm thinking more about the Fremantle timeline since Diablo is too soon to implement radical changes.--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:38, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
			:::::If the frequency of updates is on the same order of magnitude of current "maemo Linux based OS" releases (i.e. a couple a year), carefully crafting the naming seems to me to be a monumental waste of effort. However, if a) there's going to be lots and lots and some careful differentiation is required; or there'll be many more Nokia self-installable apps released (or other, non-free apps in addition to the couple we've got already); the distinction may be worth investing in. Alternatively, I've got the wrong end of the stick.

imported_>qgil: /* Binary-only packages? */

2008-06-22T19:38:35Z

Binary-only packages?

← Older revision		Revision as of 19:38, 22 June 2008
Line 20:		Line 20:
	::As a note aside, should we discusse now the possibility of having free & non-free sections (or universe / multiverse) for these 3rd party repository that today we call extras? I mean, imagine that one day Nokia packages are published as i.e. Main / Restricted. Is this on topic here?--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:11, 22 June 2008 (UTC)		::As a note aside, should we discusse now the possibility of having free & non-free sections (or universe / multiverse) for these 3rd party repository that today we call extras? I mean, imagine that one day Nokia packages are published as i.e. Main / Restricted. Is this on topic here?--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:11, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
	:::Wherever possible, I'm in favour of copying best practice. If it's good enough for Ubuntu to copy (and tweak) from Debian, it should be possible for us to copy from Ubuntu (and tweak). Having said that, until diablo's released (I put off installing the unreleased version), I think SSU is too much of a wildcard to make ''many'' decisions now. Are there any plans on Nokia's side as to the frequency of a release's in-life updates? Feature enhancements? Bug fixes? Security fixes? Or will SSU solely be used for big bang releases without having to reflash? --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 19:21, 22 June 2008 (UTC)		:::Wherever possible, I'm in favour of copying best practice. If it's good enough for Ubuntu to copy (and tweak) from Debian, it should be possible for us to copy from Ubuntu (and tweak). Having said that, until diablo's released (I put off installing the unreleased version), I think SSU is too much of a wildcard to make ''many'' decisions now. Are there any plans on Nokia's side as to the frequency of a release's in-life updates? Feature enhancements? Bug fixes? Security fixes? Or will SSU solely be used for big bang releases without having to reflash? --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 19:21, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
			::::What is the relation between having separate sections for free/non-free and frequency of updates? In any case I'm thinking more about the Fremantle timeline since Diablo is too soon to implement radical changes.--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:38, 22 June 2008 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 11:00, 23 June 2008
Line 23:		Line 23:
	::::What is the relation between having separate sections for free/non-free and frequency of updates? In any case I'm thinking more about the Fremantle timeline since Diablo is too soon to implement radical changes.--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:38, 22 June 2008 (UTC)		::::What is the relation between having separate sections for free/non-free and frequency of updates? In any case I'm thinking more about the Fremantle timeline since Diablo is too soon to implement radical changes.--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:38, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
	::::This SSU thing is an entirely different thing and is not being served from the extras repository. As I understand it is for ''system'' updates (applications part of the base system, not for ''application'' updates (community provided applications). --[[User:xfade\|xfade]] 10:10, 23 June 2008 (UTC)		::::This SSU thing is an entirely different thing and is not being served from the extras repository. As I understand it is for ''system'' updates (applications part of the base system, not for ''application'' updates (community provided applications). --[[User:xfade\|xfade]] 10:10, 23 June 2008 (UTC)
			:::::I still fail to see what is the relation between SSU and free/non-free, but I just thorught youd like to know that yes, users get SSU updates when new versions of their installed extras software are available.--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 11:00, 23 June 2008 (UTC)
	:::::If the frequency of updates is on the same order of magnitude of current "maemo Linux based OS" releases (i.e. a couple a year), carefully crafting the naming seems to me to be a monumental waste of effort. However, if a) there's going to be lots and lots and some careful differentiation is required; or there'll be many more Nokia self-installable apps released (or other, non-free apps in addition to the couple we've got already); the distinction may be worth investing in. Alternatively, I've got the wrong end of the stick. --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 19:43, 22 June 2008 (UTC)		:::::If the frequency of updates is on the same order of magnitude of current "maemo Linux based OS" releases (i.e. a couple a year), carefully crafting the naming seems to me to be a monumental waste of effort. However, if a) there's going to be lots and lots and some careful differentiation is required; or there'll be many more Nokia self-installable apps released (or other, non-free apps in addition to the couple we've got already); the distinction may be worth investing in. Alternatively, I've got the wrong end of the stick. --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 19:43, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
	::::::Alright, let me rephrase my own question above: would it make sense to differentiate free and non-free extras packages in different sections? (the discussion about Nokia packages is not urgent and belongs to somewhere else)--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:56, 22 June 2008 (UTC)		::::::Alright, let me rephrase my own question above: would it make sense to differentiate free and non-free extras packages in different sections? (the discussion about Nokia packages is not urgent and belongs to somewhere else)--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:56, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
	:::::::From the user's point of view? Probably not. From a community point of view? Not sure. From Nokia's point-of-view? I'm not in a position to answer, but is it likely/possible that at some point extras (in some form) will be enabled by default? If so, does a free/non-free separation have any bearing on it? --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 20:05, 22 June 2008 (UTC)		:::::::From the user's point of view? Probably not. From a community point of view? Not sure. From Nokia's point-of-view? I'm not in a position to answer, but is it likely/possible that at some point extras (in some form) will be enabled by default? If so, does a free/non-free separation have any bearing on it? --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 20:05, 22 June 2008 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 10:10, 23 June 2008
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	:Of course, a "source" package is just a package which can be extracted, a particular command run and a binary deb produced. There's nothing stopping closed source authors such as INDT producing a "source" package containing the binary files and a script to produce the binary deb. This'd satisfy the "only packages which can be built using the autobuilder" requirement ''and'' add an extra level of complexity to people wanting to use the maemo.org '''community''' repository for their closed source applications. --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 18:59, 21 June 2008 (UTC)		:Of course, a "source" package is just a package which can be extracted, a particular command run and a binary deb produced. There's nothing stopping closed source authors such as INDT producing a "source" package containing the binary files and a script to produce the binary deb. This'd satisfy the "only packages which can be built using the autobuilder" requirement ''and'' add an extra level of complexity to people wanting to use the maemo.org '''community''' repository for their closed source applications. --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 18:59, 21 June 2008 (UTC)
	::As a note aside, should we discusse now the possibility of having free & non-free sections (or universe / multiverse) for these 3rd party repository that today we call extras? I mean, imagine that one day Nokia packages are published as i.e. Main / Restricted. Is this on topic here?--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:11, 22 June 2008 (UTC)		::As a note aside, should we discusse now the possibility of having free & non-free sections (or universe / multiverse) for these 3rd party repository that today we call extras? I mean, imagine that one day Nokia packages are published as i.e. Main / Restricted. Is this on topic here?--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:11, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
			::I think the free/non-free thing would be a good solution. But for the community repository, surely we should aim to have as much source available as possible. --[[User:xfade\|xfade]] 10:10, 23 June 2008 (UTC)
	:::Wherever possible, I'm in favour of copying best practice. If it's good enough for Ubuntu to copy (and tweak) from Debian, it should be possible for us to copy from Ubuntu (and tweak). Having said that, until diablo's released (I put off installing the unreleased version), I think SSU is too much of a wildcard to make ''many'' decisions now. Are there any plans on Nokia's side as to the frequency of a release's in-life updates? Feature enhancements? Bug fixes? Security fixes? Or will SSU solely be used for big bang releases without having to reflash? --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 19:21, 22 June 2008 (UTC)		:::Wherever possible, I'm in favour of copying best practice. If it's good enough for Ubuntu to copy (and tweak) from Debian, it should be possible for us to copy from Ubuntu (and tweak). Having said that, until diablo's released (I put off installing the unreleased version), I think SSU is too much of a wildcard to make ''many'' decisions now. Are there any plans on Nokia's side as to the frequency of a release's in-life updates? Feature enhancements? Bug fixes? Security fixes? Or will SSU solely be used for big bang releases without having to reflash? --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 19:21, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
	::::What is the relation between having separate sections for free/non-free and frequency of updates? In any case I'm thinking more about the Fremantle timeline since Diablo is too soon to implement radical changes.--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:38, 22 June 2008 (UTC)		::::What is the relation between having separate sections for free/non-free and frequency of updates? In any case I'm thinking more about the Fremantle timeline since Diablo is too soon to implement radical changes.--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:38, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
			::::This SSU thing is an entirely different thing and is not being served from the extras repository. As I understand it is for ''system'' updates (applications part of the base system, not for ''application'' updates (community provided applications). --[[User:xfade\|xfade]] 10:10, 23 June 2008 (UTC)
	:::::If the frequency of updates is on the same order of magnitude of current "maemo Linux based OS" releases (i.e. a couple a year), carefully crafting the naming seems to me to be a monumental waste of effort. However, if a) there's going to be lots and lots and some careful differentiation is required; or there'll be many more Nokia self-installable apps released (or other, non-free apps in addition to the couple we've got already); the distinction may be worth investing in. Alternatively, I've got the wrong end of the stick. --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 19:43, 22 June 2008 (UTC)		:::::If the frequency of updates is on the same order of magnitude of current "maemo Linux based OS" releases (i.e. a couple a year), carefully crafting the naming seems to me to be a monumental waste of effort. However, if a) there's going to be lots and lots and some careful differentiation is required; or there'll be many more Nokia self-installable apps released (or other, non-free apps in addition to the couple we've got already); the distinction may be worth investing in. Alternatively, I've got the wrong end of the stick. --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 19:43, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
	::::::Alright, let me rephrase my own question above: would it make sense to differentiate free and non-free extras packages in different sections? (the discussion about Nokia packages is not urgent and belongs to somewhere else)--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:56, 22 June 2008 (UTC)		::::::Alright, let me rephrase my own question above: would it make sense to differentiate free and non-free extras packages in different sections? (the discussion about Nokia packages is not urgent and belongs to somewhere else)--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:56, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
	:::::::From the user's point of view? Probably not. From a community point of view? Not sure. From Nokia's point-of-view? I'm not in a position to answer, but is it likely/possible that at some point extras (in some form) will be enabled by default? If so, does a free/non-free separation have any bearing on it? --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 20:05, 22 June 2008 (UTC)		:::::::From the user's point of view? Probably not. From a community point of view? Not sure. From Nokia's point-of-view? I'm not in a position to answer, but is it likely/possible that at some point extras (in some form) will be enabled by default? If so, does a free/non-free separation have any bearing on it? --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 20:05, 22 June 2008 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 20:05, 22 June 2008
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	:::::If the frequency of updates is on the same order of magnitude of current "maemo Linux based OS" releases (i.e. a couple a year), carefully crafting the naming seems to me to be a monumental waste of effort. However, if a) there's going to be lots and lots and some careful differentiation is required; or there'll be many more Nokia self-installable apps released (or other, non-free apps in addition to the couple we've got already); the distinction may be worth investing in. Alternatively, I've got the wrong end of the stick. --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 19:43, 22 June 2008 (UTC)		:::::If the frequency of updates is on the same order of magnitude of current "maemo Linux based OS" releases (i.e. a couple a year), carefully crafting the naming seems to me to be a monumental waste of effort. However, if a) there's going to be lots and lots and some careful differentiation is required; or there'll be many more Nokia self-installable apps released (or other, non-free apps in addition to the couple we've got already); the distinction may be worth investing in. Alternatively, I've got the wrong end of the stick. --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 19:43, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
	::::::Alright, let me rephrase my own question above: would it make sense to differentiate free and non-free extras packages in different sections? (the discussion about Nokia packages is not urgent and belongs to somewhere else)--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:56, 22 June 2008 (UTC)		::::::Alright, let me rephrase my own question above: would it make sense to differentiate free and non-free extras packages in different sections? (the discussion about Nokia packages is not urgent and belongs to somewhere else)--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:56, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
			:::::::From the user's point of view? Probably not. From a community point of view? Not sure. From Nokia's point-of-view? I'm not in a position to answer, but is it likely/possible that at some point extras (in some form) will be enabled by default? If so, does a free/non-free separation have any bearing on it? --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 20:05, 22 June 2008 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 19:56, 22 June 2008
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	::::What is the relation between having separate sections for free/non-free and frequency of updates? In any case I'm thinking more about the Fremantle timeline since Diablo is too soon to implement radical changes.--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:38, 22 June 2008 (UTC)		::::What is the relation between having separate sections for free/non-free and frequency of updates? In any case I'm thinking more about the Fremantle timeline since Diablo is too soon to implement radical changes.--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:38, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
	:::::If the frequency of updates is on the same order of magnitude of current "maemo Linux based OS" releases (i.e. a couple a year), carefully crafting the naming seems to me to be a monumental waste of effort. However, if a) there's going to be lots and lots and some careful differentiation is required; or there'll be many more Nokia self-installable apps released (or other, non-free apps in addition to the couple we've got already); the distinction may be worth investing in. Alternatively, I've got the wrong end of the stick. --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 19:43, 22 June 2008 (UTC)		:::::If the frequency of updates is on the same order of magnitude of current "maemo Linux based OS" releases (i.e. a couple a year), carefully crafting the naming seems to me to be a monumental waste of effort. However, if a) there's going to be lots and lots and some careful differentiation is required; or there'll be many more Nokia self-installable apps released (or other, non-free apps in addition to the couple we've got already); the distinction may be worth investing in. Alternatively, I've got the wrong end of the stick. --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 19:43, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
			::::::Alright, let me rephrase my own question above: would it make sense to differentiate free and non-free extras packages in different sections? (the discussion about Nokia packages is not urgent and belongs to somewhere else)--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:56, 22 June 2008 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 19:38, 22 June 2008
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	::As a note aside, should we discusse now the possibility of having free & non-free sections (or universe / multiverse) for these 3rd party repository that today we call extras? I mean, imagine that one day Nokia packages are published as i.e. Main / Restricted. Is this on topic here?--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:11, 22 June 2008 (UTC)		::As a note aside, should we discusse now the possibility of having free & non-free sections (or universe / multiverse) for these 3rd party repository that today we call extras? I mean, imagine that one day Nokia packages are published as i.e. Main / Restricted. Is this on topic here?--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:11, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
	:::Wherever possible, I'm in favour of copying best practice. If it's good enough for Ubuntu to copy (and tweak) from Debian, it should be possible for us to copy from Ubuntu (and tweak). Having said that, until diablo's released (I put off installing the unreleased version), I think SSU is too much of a wildcard to make ''many'' decisions now. Are there any plans on Nokia's side as to the frequency of a release's in-life updates? Feature enhancements? Bug fixes? Security fixes? Or will SSU solely be used for big bang releases without having to reflash? --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 19:21, 22 June 2008 (UTC)		:::Wherever possible, I'm in favour of copying best practice. If it's good enough for Ubuntu to copy (and tweak) from Debian, it should be possible for us to copy from Ubuntu (and tweak). Having said that, until diablo's released (I put off installing the unreleased version), I think SSU is too much of a wildcard to make ''many'' decisions now. Are there any plans on Nokia's side as to the frequency of a release's in-life updates? Feature enhancements? Bug fixes? Security fixes? Or will SSU solely be used for big bang releases without having to reflash? --[[User:jaffa\|Jaffa]] 19:21, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
			::::What is the relation between having separate sections for free/non-free and frequency of updates? In any case I'm thinking more about the Fremantle timeline since Diablo is too soon to implement radical changes.--[[User:qgil\|qgil]] 19:38, 22 June 2008 (UTC)